The Biblical Response to Critical Race Theory with Christian Author, Bryan Osborne

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Well, hello and welcome back to the Master Books Podcast. We have a real treat today. We have several participants who are going to be here talking with Brian Osborne of Answers in Genesis. Brian is the author of Master Books new book wild. Newly publishing group's new book, Woke Injustice A Biblical Response to Critical Race Theory. Everybody that I've shared this book with so far is so impressed with the detail, the research, and how practical the application of this information is.

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So this is a topic that we really need to talk about. And it's not, always accepted as, readily as we'd want it to. So we just want to, as Christians, strengthen ourselves to be ready to have a biblical response to the issues that are being impacted by critical race theory. And we're so thankful that Brian has, helped us do that with his new book.

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Brian also is the author of several other resources, which we'll talk about when I bring him on. So we are going to get started. But before we do, I want to make sure that you remember that we give away a digital copy of a book when we're featuring it on our Master Books podcast. So today we'll be giving away a digital copy of Woke and Justice to someone on the Master Books app and someone on the moms of Master Books Facebook group.

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You'll have direction as to how to enter to win, and one person who comments will be chosen to win. So let's get started here at Master Books, we are dedicated to help you disciple your children and develop a strong faith as a family with pro Bible, homeschool curriculum, and beautiful books that honor God as creator, we offer online courses to help your family worship and serve God.

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You will also find morning baskets and devotionals for the whole family. Our mission is ink on paper to touch eternity, and we have been publishing Christian books for this purpose since 1975. Find your Pro Bible Homeschool curriculum at Master Book Scholars. Well, Brian, welcome back to the Master Books podcast. It is always fun to interview you here. Well, thanks for having me back.

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It is great to be back in the chat about this really important topic for sure. Absolutely. So tell us a little bit about what you do at Answers in Genesis and why you chose to write this book. Yes, I'm a speaker and writer with answers in Genesis, so I do a lot of speaking on apologetics issues, equipping Christians to defend their faith.

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Of course. Answers to Genesis. We are an apologetics ministry, so we have the Ark Encounter, the Creation Museum, and lots of resources that we create. And it's all about really helping Christians to stand on God's Word, to defend the faith, to proclaim the gospel and really be salt and light. God, God's called us to be. And so our passion is biblical authority and the gospel rooted in that.

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And that's really one of the main driving forces behind this particular book, woke injustice. And that is really is I began to look at this issue in our culture of critical race theory, the modern social justice movement, the different tenets of that. Are we going to really see this was an attack on biblical authority that was infiltrating a lot of the church.

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And so I wanted to give Christians the answers they needed, rooted in God's Word to defend the faith and reclaim the gospel and not be captured by really secular, false, unbiblical ideas. And then, a little bit selfishly, I wanted to equip myself more thoroughly on the issue and then also put my own family, my own kids, and those around me and those within the body of Christ.

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To have that biblical understanding to find our identity in Christ, not as secular philosophies. And so all those things kind of came together and got open up doors for me to start speaking about this. I did a lot of research and then I God's grace, where we could put the research together and present hopefully a concise book to give Christians practical answers.

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Well, we are thrilled with the book. Everybody, as I mentioned before who has read it, is just so impressed with what you've done here and I'm excited to get it in the hands of our audience. I'll be so. Yeah, absolutely. So I wanted to just thank you for your dedication to this topic and to apologetics. I really appreciate the fact that the Lord has given you a talent and biblical talent to steward, and you have stewarded it well, especially with this book.

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And then your other two books. Tell everybody about your other two books real quick. Oh yeah. So quick answers to tough questions and quick answers to social issues. And so that answers the genesis. Of course we do a lot with science issues, origin issues, the age of the earth, rock layers, fossils, dinosaurs in the Bible, those sorts of things.

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So my first book are quick answers to tough questions, gives you concise answers to all those things. We've got a ton of in-depth resources, you know, books that I've really deep and they're really long and they're great resources. But for a lot of us, we just want the ad friendly version. And so you, me just it's oh, me too.

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And so that's my own way of thinking. So I just kind of boil the things down to the basic components here. The shortest answers you can have, but so biblically concise and biblically accurate. And so that was for science issues, 33, questions answered in that book. Second book was on quick answers to social issues. And so same philosophy apply to biblical answers to issues of life equality, sexuality and environment.

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So biblical answers to abortion, euthanasia, stem cell research, social justice. Short answer on that one. Racism, the LGBTQ ideology, the whole revolution within our culture, transgenderism, social justice, the green movement, the climate change movement, all of those things. Short, concise biblical answers and, including Christians who stand to defend. And I tell people as Christians, we've got answers, and they're really not that hard.

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Now, granted, they may not be popular in our current cultural context. I understand that, but they're not hard if we just trust God's word and we can think biblically and really be effective ambassadors for Christ. And really, the very Babylon like culture we live in today. Absolutely. Well, you wrote them well. You said it well. And one thing is for sure, you're really good at giving concise answers, and I'm so thankful that everyone will have in this book concise answers for the critical race theory.

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So what we're going to do in today's podcast is we have one, two, three, four, including me, five people that are going to ask you questions and I'm going to bring them on screen one by one. They'll introduce themselves to you and to the listener, and then they have a question ready to ask you about your book and about this topic.

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And then after each one finishes, then we'll bring the next one on. Sounds good. Hey, Rebecca. Hey, Brian. It's so nice to see you today. And I want to say thank you. Thank you for writing this book. I'm so impressed. I think it's so, so impressed. I'm a retired homeschool mom. I homeschool our three kids. For praise God hears.

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Praise the Lord. Yes. That he provided. My husband and I are ministering to active duty military and government employees. He's actually a Navy chaplain. Oh, good. Yeah, it's it's phenomenal ministry. And, you know, included in that means we are, ministering to people of varying faith backgrounds, Christians, but different faith traditions. And we often don't really know what they've been taught before.

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They come to the base where we're ministering. And as we seek to build a community that emphasizes our common faith in Jesus, what starts to happen is we realize that they have very different views of critical race theory, social justice, and it, sometimes sort of sneaks up on us and it really threatens to be divisive. And at a time when we really need the members of that command to be unified, especially the Christians, because we're we're still in the minority, right?

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Even in that, in that situation. And when the topic comes up, it can often be, in a public setting where there are other people in the congregation who are hearing, and I feel really ill equipped to address it well and succinctly. And so my question is this if you only had time for an elevator pitch, 1 to 2 minutes, for why CRT and the social justice movement are, as you state in, chapter 14, pervasively anti biblical, which I thought was a great phrase.

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What would you say? Where would you start and just do it very quickly. Yeah. So I'll give you the really short version then we can expand it out from there. The short version, the extreme short version will be this, number one, we must understand that on every issue, it comes down to either God's word is your authority or man's word is.

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There are only two foundational worldviews. You put your faith in one or the other. And so we're going to start there. So if you put your faith, a man's ideas or God's Word. And then secondly, when you look at, the modern social justice movement, which is born straight up out of critical race theory or CRT comes from, comes from Marxism.

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Marxism is a secular anti biblical worldview. And so it's putting your faith in a different foundation other than God's Word. If you put your faith there and that ideology and because it's rooted in man's ideas, in short, CRT gets humanity's identity wrong, it gets our problem wrong, and it gets the solution catastrophically wrong. And so, in short, that's why would be anti biblical.

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It undermines biblical authority, gospel sufficiency, biblical anthropology, and the just trust in God's word overall. And then you can kind of flesh it out from there. So that's a big picture. And of course the details need to be filled in with that. But here's how it gets those core three things wrong. It gets our identity wrong. So we're expounding a bit here.

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CRT is your identity is found based on a particular physical trait like skin shade. So if you're a light brown what they call white then you're part of the oppressor class. If you are dark brown, what they call black, you're part of the oppressed class. CRT says you're either an oppressor or the oppressed, and so the oppressor is guilty because they are the oppressive influence in our culture.

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The oppressed are by definition. So you're the guilty or innocent based on what group you're assigned. And then so it gets our identity wrong. The Bible says we're made in God's image, equal in value, and we're all broken by sin, which is the second part. What is our problem? Our problem is sin. CRT says no, the problem is oppression.

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Only the oppressors are guilty. So I guess the problem role in the book also that it gets the solution wrong with the law. CRT says the solution to the brokenness of our culture and racial reconciliation is a revolution. We got to tear down the systemically racist culture we live in a rebuild. It's a Marxist utopia. The Bible says no.

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The solution is the gospel of Jesus Christ that changes hearts, lives and thinking and that can change the culture. And so that's the expanded of that. So what I'm saying, yeah, CRT rooted in, Marxism, secular humanism, a biblical worldview gets our identity wrong, gets our problem wrong, gets the solution wrong. And because that is pervasively anti biblical.

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Hi, my name is Dusty Struble, and my husband and I are actively homeschooling our four children who range in age from 15. Yeah, it's a blessing. That's awesome. So I have a question for you. Let me get my thing. CRT seems to be present in every area of our society to include children's books and television shows, library programs, and even places like the zoo and grocery stores.

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How would you approach this topic in an age appropriate fashion, with young children, who will inevitably be exposed to it somewhere along the way? Yeah, that's a great question. And you are exactly right. CRT it is literally everywhere in our culture. It saturates our cultural landscape and in my book I really detail where you can see it in elementary school levels, you know, middle school, high school and our culture at large.

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It's everywhere. And I think it's a great question to ask, you know, how do we equip our kids to do this in an age appropriate level? It's very relevant to me because similar to you, I have two children, ten and six, and we are homeschooling. And so how do I quit my own kids to be ready to engage on this issue and have a biblical worldview?

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And I think what we do first and foremost is with the younger kids, especially the younger they are, we just want to give them the right foundation in God's Word. So, number one, you want them to know that God's Word is our authority. It is the it is sufficient to deal with any and every issue. So sad. How to live you know about morality, how we should treat others, how we should worship, how we should spend money.

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The Bible, God's Word, is our authority. So build that thinking and also go back to that as our foundation. And then we can start teaching them biblical truths that do counter the CRT narrative. Now we don't have to get to the CRT narrative just yet when they're younger, but teaching them biblical truths will prepare them. So who are we?

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Well, we are made in God's image that defines who we are. We're not defined as an oppressor or the oppressed based on our skin. Now you're defined as an image bearer of God because he made you in his image. And that first and foremost defines who we are. And then the other biblical truths of we're also broken by sin, and we descend from Adam.

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That's what we're all sinners by nature and by choice. And we all need saving to the last Adam, Jesus Christ. Then we can explain to our kids and of see it in different ways. Our world is so broken in so many ways because of sin. And the Bible gives the answer which was found in the gospel, the good news of Christ.

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And so building up thinking, giving them a biblical foundation of who we are, what our problem is, what the right solution is. And as a ministry, we used the seven seas, creation, corruption, catastrophe, confusing cries cross consummation to give people a biblical framework, a summary of biblical history, a biblical worldview within which to answer the question in this age.

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So we give our kids a biblical perspective, and then as I get older, we can start to introduce them to different, secular ideas that they will encounter head on later on at age appropriate levels. And I think this is such a great thing to do, because we can kind of control the conversation a bit. We can help them to think through these issues biblically while they're still with us.

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And that is so important to do because, as you said, our kids will run into these ideas one way or another eventually. I think here's a problem that many, a mistake that many Christian parents have made, like, for example, the evolution the over the years, they'll tell their kids why evolution is bad. It's wrong. Don't believe it.

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I just believe the Bible. But they never tell their kids. What does evolution teach and how do I rightly respond to those arguments? And so when they go to a second university and they run into evolutionary arguments, they think, oh, well, these professors are really persuasive. My parents never mentioned this before, so maybe they didn't know. Maybe they don't have a good answer.

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So maybe the professors are right. So rather than letting that happen, know why they're so with us. Here's what the world teaches age appropriate levels. Here's the biblical answer rooted a biblical foundation. You know, they go to university and they hear the end. Same thing. Like, oh, I've heard this before. Yeah. No, no, no, I know they answer that when they go to the workplace and a coworker says this or that.

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The other about CRT or the oppressor and the oppressor, like they can say, no, I've heard this before. I know where that comes from. That's Marxism, the secular pagan ideology. It's everything wrong. And when you start with God's Word, we can give them that foundation. So I said a lot, I think, in short, younger kids, biblical truth, God's word is the authority we look to here have that biblical worldview being built as I get older, bring the ideas to them in an appropriate level, age appropriate level, and walk them through it with you with a good resource.

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Our website answers and justice.org has tons of that. And then on this issue woke injustice. It's really just meant to give you a good, concise overview of all the ideas with biblical responses. My whole goal with the book was simply to say, hey, here's what CRT teaches. Here are its definitions and definitions. Here are the biblical passages that refute those things.

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Put your trust in God's Word. And so it's really an easy kind of walk through all those issues and I think help parents do that. Well, hey, how's it going, Brian? I'm Matt, how are you? Good. So, man, this book was really eye opening for me. I'm still reading it, so I apologize if the book already answered this question.

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Okay, so one of the questions I had was, you know, what's it going to take to stop CRT? You know, how can I be a part of the solution? Will it ever end? Yeah. So, well, yes it will. There will one day be a new heavens and a new earth, and. Right. Yeah. You know, of course there will be perfection there.

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And of course, we'll struggle with sin, personally and as a culture, until Christ does return, no doubt about that. But there are things we can do. And really, CRT is nothing new. It's the same Genesis three attack. Did God really say and try and get people to really reject biblical authority, to reject God's Word and turn their own devices instead?

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That's really what it is. And so the answer is still the same. And so, I think, yes, there are there are things we can definitely do as Christians. Number one, we need to stand on God's Word. We need to take every thought captive, make it obedient to Christ. That's how we're part of the solution. As we look at issues from a biblical perspective.

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And what so many Christians don't understand is a CRT, it's not a helpful analytical tool. It's an entire worldview that's rooted out of Marxism, which is anti biblical Marxism says Christianity is part of the problem. And so so I sadly, ironically, Christians take Marx's concept and try to use those and try to add those to the Bible. We're trying to add an anti biblical worldview to your biblical text and biblical perspective.

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That just doesn't make any sense. Now we start with God's Word and use that as our foundation. It gives us the right understanding of who we are, our problem, the solution. Right justice. What that actually looks like, what's happening in our culture, how to deal with racial reconciliation or the reconciliation period. What about ethnicities? It gives us all the answers if we start rooted in God's Word.

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And so, yes, we can be part of the solution if we will stand on God's Word and engage the culture. Yes, in love, but also in truth with God's truth and the gospel. And so by saying God's Word, but proclaiming that truth and reclaiming the gospel, you can see hearts and lives that are changed for the glory of God.

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And as people are changed through God's word is truth in the gospel that can change our thinking, that can change a culture. We have seen in the past, cultures that were, almost utterly remade because of a gospel impact, or cultures that are molded by a biblical worldview that leads to human flourishing. That can happen again by God's grace if we'll stand.

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And then I think the important thing to remember here, I use this analogy in my book. When I talk about these issues, we can learn a lesson from the past. It's interesting when slavery was very prominent in the past in America, the question comes, why didn't the church stand up and lead the charge to utterly abolish slavery? Now, many Christians did, and it was a Christian worldview, Christians with a worldview that led the abolition of slavery in America throughout the West.

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But why didn't the church as a whole and unified and fight against slavery and reject its basic tenets? That said, you know, they could have said no, that if some people are more valuable than others, you can own people. That's utterly ridiculous. Now we're made in God's image, equal and value because of that fact. And so and we're also a broken sinner.

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So we need saving through the gospel of Jesus Christ. Why didn't the church lead the charge to abolish slavery? I think two reasons. Number one, many Christians at the time had compromise with the secular thinking of their day. They had bought into the lies of their culture and they said, oh, well, maybe people, some are better than others.

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Maybe it's okay to own slaves. Some of those Christians even twisted scripture to try to prove their point and validate their wrong ideas. And I think many other Christians at the time, they didn't agree with the culture perspective, but they said, you know what? I don't know how to respond. I don't really have any answers. I'm afraid if I do respond to them, that'll happen.

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So here's what I'll do.

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I'll just disengage from the culture and you guys can do with it what you will and you see what happens. And friends, we will never influence this culture for Christ by abandoning God's Word, abandoning the culture. Now we stand on God's Word, take every thought captive, make it obedient to Christ, and engage the culture with God's truth and the gospel.

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And God can work through that to change hearts and lives and change the culture. And so and I'm going to preach you on that. But that's the answer. And I know it's down. So Sunday School is but it's the right answer. It's God's Word. It is the gospel. It is truth that changes people from the inside out. And that's why we must stand all.

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And so, yes, there is an answer. We can be part of the solution. And then maybe we can raise the coming generations to have that biblical worldview rooted in biblical thinking, to get biblical answers on race and who we are and what our problem is, what the solution is. And then they can be salt and light, and then we can see God use that for his glory and change, maybe our culture and bring revival, which would be a wonderful thing to see in our land.

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Hi, Brian. Hey, my name is Amy Scarf and I am a mom, a master books, and a coach on the martial arts app. I have four kiddos that we are homeschooling. From age 6 to 11 currently. So, Yeah. Busy season. My question actually piggybacks really well on what you and Matt were just talking about.

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So great timing for this. So when you talk about taking a stand, you have a chapter in the book that specifically talks about, going woke or getting canceled. And, we obviously are seeing that happen a lot in our culture in general. And so as believers, when it comes to taking that stand, how do we go about doing that?

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You know, also realizing that the possibility of getting canceled is very real. You know, we're seeing the the social media kind of blocking, essentially when you're trying to post truth. And I mean, we just see it everywhere. So, you know, when it comes to sharing the truth, what is the best way that we can be doing that, to still be respectful and mindful of what's going on there, but also still living out what the gospel really teaches.

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Yeah, you're right, it does piggyback really well to what we're just talking about. And I think we do that by understanding, an interesting dichotomy that we live in as Christians. That is, as Christians, we are taught we are called to fight against horrible ideas, biblical ideas that dishonor God and lead to human harm. And so we are called to fight against those things passionately.

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At the same time, we are called to love the lost and to preach the gospel. And so I think we have this balance of where we love people, we honor them. They're made in God's image, and we treat them with the respect they are due because of that fact. And even if it's an ardent atheist who hates my guts and, you know, even if they're, you know, and they're being aggressive, I still care for them because, number one, they have an eternal soul that will live forever.

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Somewhere. And my biggest hope should be that they get saved and they live in heaven forever by putting their faith in Christ instead of going to hell by rejecting Christ. And then that's my number one goal. And number two, even if they don't put their faith in Christ, they're still an image bearer. Now, maybe they're doing a bad job of it.

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At the moment they're yelling at me, but they still are made in God's image and deserve my respect because of that. And so what we can do is if we keep that in mind, we can understand that there are ideas that we can and must fight against for the glory of God, for the good of humanity. And as we do so, we do it with respect and love for people, even those who hold those ideas.

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So in a real sense, yes, we do have to speak against people what they're saying, but we're also hoping they get saved in the process. So by a way that I think we can, speak truth and love without compromise. And that's where so many Christians, I think, struggle so hard. And if you think about it, this is from Jody Bochum.

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He says this all the time within American Christianity, there's just like 11th commandment, thou must be nice. And then we forget the other ten, you know, and we do want to be respectful and kind, but we have to be also willing to be offensive in a loving way, because God's Word is offensive. And we know when God's Word contradicts what you think, well, that's going to offend somebody and that's okay.

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And so I, I really think about, you know, Daniel, Daniel, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, I remember them over in Babylon, and they were serving a pagan king. And if you look at it, they were serving that king faithfully. I mean, they were doing a good job. They were working hard. And whenever a conflict arose, they still answer the king with respect.

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But they did bow to compromise. You know, Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego, you know, hey, we don't they when they're asked about, you know, will you actually bow? And they said, no, we don't need to answer you on this, King. But God can save us. They and their response, if you read the text, they were very respectful to the king.

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But at the same time they're saying, no, King, we won't bow, we won't. And so I think in a real way, that's what we must do. As we look at our culture, we will not bow to an anti-God, anti biblical ideology that is bent on human destruction and actually leading people away from the gospel, which is eternal destruction.

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Now, we won't bow out of that, but we will lovingly engage. We'll work hard, we'll be the best employees, will be as nice as we can. We're going to bring you food when you're sick, if you're our neighbors and if you don't, you know, like us, we're going to care about you trying to meet your needs. We're going to the same time.

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We're going to preach the gospel and live according to God's Word. And if we must be thrown in the lion's den, and if we must be thrown into the fiery furnace, if we are cancel, well, God's in control, that too he will take care of us. But as we live, we will do our best to be faithful. That's all saying a lot, but I think it's a balance of they're made in God's image.

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Respect them. We don't compromise. We love God, serve him first, and then we let the chips fall where they may. And, God will got all that. And either way, I'll use it for his glory. And, and we'll see how he, is glorified to the uttermost as we are faithful to him. Brian, these have been so educational, these questions that everyone's been asking you.

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I'm so glad we're going to have this encapsulated in a video that we can go back to and use, to help guide people as they read your book and want to know how to apply this to their own lives. I was looking at chapter four and talk a lot about racism in chapter four. You say that there is one biblical, historical, and scientific truth that exposes the innate idiocy of racism.

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So tell us what truth you're talking about. There. Can I just say, I like that sentence. I like how it turned out. But, sometimes it really is fun to craft those sentences. Yeah, I'm much more articulate than you. Can we just speaking off the cuff? But know what I'm talking about. Is this this biblical truth, the scientific truth that there is just one race, the human race.

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That's it. We all come from Adam and Eve. Genetics confirms us history confirms this. The Bible confirms this. There is just one race, the human race. So in order to be racist, you'd have to hate your own race. Because there is just one race. The human race, which is utterly ridiculous. And so and also in connection to CRT, in order for there to be oppression of one race over another, there have to be different races.

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But there is just one race. The human race. Right? And so it really is undermining the foundational level. Now, to be fair, there are different ethnicities. And you can kind of we can talk about that as a different area and kind of branch into that. But really I'm saying that foundation, what people think biblically about this, know there are multiple races.

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We don't come from an evolved ape man that evolved some superior races and some inferior races, like Darwin thought no, no, no, no. We come from God. He made us in his image. We come from Adam and Eve, equal and value broken by sin, that we need a Savior. That's the answer. And so that's why what this book is worth pointing to.

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And, you know, I cover so many chapters, you mentioned the the issue of racism. I do dive into that to give people an idea of the flow of the book. Start off with understanding. So worldview issue. I define CRT where came from. Then I give them an overview. Here are the kind of the eight core principles of critical race theory and the ones that look like in America.

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After that, I go through and kind of you look at the popular terms that you see in our culture all the time, like, what do they mean by whiteness and white privilege and white supremacy? It's been redefined. It doesn't mean what you think it means. They have a new definition for it. And so understanding that they've redefined racism in a similar way.

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So we go through that and we talk about wokeness and how really woke justice is injustice. Ironically, here's the crazy thing. When they are, they're actually using injustice in the name of justice. That is, they actually want to fight discrimination by using discrimination. They want to fight racism by using actual, real racism. That's what's really being fleshed out.

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And that's why the title woke injustice, because it's being presented as justice. But sadly, ironically, it's actually injustice. And so we're pointing that out. Defining anti-racism equity is the modern day social justice movement biblical? The short answer is no. But then I give the right answer. The answer to racism is found in God's Word in the gospel, Jesus Christ.

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In that curse, the Christian God's Word is sufficient. It is. It's got the answers to justice and reconciliation. We find those answers in God's Word alone. If you're Christian, don't be scared. Stand firm and you can defend a faith. And so that's a kind of a summary of the book, but it gives you very snappy answers, pointing to God's Word as a refutation of this really pagan, non-biblical, antithetical to the Bible ideology.

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Sure. So I have another quote that I wanted to bring up, because it's so strong, and I'm glad you wrote it this way. You say that historically, what has historically been called racism is actually discriminatory ethnic hatred. So talk to us a little bit about that. Yeah. And so one of the things I point out is that, you find what people call racism around the world and racism and truth is ethnic partiality because there's just one.

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Right? So you really can't have racism, but you can have people hating other people. So different ethnicities today, different ethnicities based on different factors. And as I've traveled the world, I've seen this on a global scale. And the reason I pointed out in the book is that critical race theorists, would like you to believe that, you know, racism or ethnic partiality only exists in America, which could not be further from the truth.

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This hatred exists around the world. What is racism or ethnic partiality? What is it at its core? The sin of pride? It just basically says, I'm better than you. Pick your reason and the reasons vary around the globe. And so some places it might be, well, you're lighter than me, so therefore I'm better than you or your darker than me, then I'm better than you.

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I've got more money than you. I'm better than you. I grew up poor. I've got better character. I'm better than you. I mean, you can pick your reason, but what it shows is in our sinful hearts, we can find any number of reasons to elevate ourselves in our own thinking and then try to push others down to make us like we are better.

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It's a sin of pride. It's literally everywhere. And so we're pointing out that's the problem. The problem isn't oppressor or oppressor versus the oppressed. Is the issue of sin the damage to human heart? So if the problem is sin, what's the answer? The gospel of Jesus Christ and a biblical worldview to correct our thinking on every issue. And so it's really just laying the foundation to get back to God's Word in the gospel.

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Absolutely. Well, while you've been talking today, one of the scriptures that's come to my mind and I can't remember where in the Bible it is, so forgive me. I know it's the New Testament, but it says, be careful that the light you think you have isn't actually darkness. So I feel like what you are doing here is exposing for people, Christians.

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You know that. Be sure that you understand what light truly is, and that what you're calling light is not darkness. That's such a good point, and it really is a big part of the book, because I even I said this a couple times in the book, I can understand why Christians get caught up in the movement. I really can, because when you look at critical race theory, you look at the modern social justice.

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Even BLM was very popular years back. They're using so many words, terms and phrases that Christians are familiar with. It just makes sense. You talk about racial reconciliation, you talk about being anti-racism. You talk about fighting for justice and fighting for the oppressed. And all those things resonate with Christians because those words also are familiar. Well, but what's so many Christians not realize is that one, the Marxist or neo-Marxist critical race theorist uses those ideas.

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So those are using that worldview. When they use those words in terms, they have a different understanding. They're using similar words with a different dictionary. And so when they use justice, they don't mean justice like you mean justice. Their definition is totally different. Their definition is about shifting power from the oppressor to the oppressed, rather than rightly treating people in line with God's Word and how we treat them in word or deed, action, thought and attitude.

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A totally different definition of justice, a totally different definition of racism and what is true and what is right, and all those things. And so it really is kind of my goal was to pull back the veil, to show them this is what is actually being taught here and these ideas that you're embracing. I know you're embracing the words, but you're embracing ideas that are actually antithetical to the gospel of Jesus Christ and biblical authority.

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Biblical truth. I know you got really good intentions, but hey, listen, I was newly married. We were poor, and I bought my wife a can opener for her birthday with the best of intentions. That was a terrible idea. Like, she had whatever she was frustrated by. I thought, this is practical. We don't have much money. She will love this.

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I had a really good intentions. Right, fellows? Never buy your wife a can opener for a birthday. That's a horrible idea. All right, good intentions, but the worst of it, and I think for so many Christians, they're embracing different tenets of this CRT ideology with really good intentions. I quote many of them in the book. Many pastors or Christian leaders are embracing various parts of this.

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I'm not talking down. I'm attacking a compromise view that's undermining biblical authority. And they're bringing they're really bringing a divisive ideology down our minds, biblical authority and the gospel. And so I want to make people aware that about the God's Word as we do, we can stand and be salt and light. It reminds me of, a friend of mine who has talked about the way she addresses issues with her daughters when when they are not respecting her anymore, she sits down with them to find out where in their relationship.

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At what point did they lose honor? At what point did they start losing respect for her authority and opinion and whatever? So that's really what you're helping people do. You're showing them, helping them pull back the veil and say, where is it that I stopped honoring God's Word and have chosen man's persuasion over that? That's a great example.

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And you're exactly right. And our ministry as a whole, that's kind of what we do. The story with Genesis, that biblical history, and I know for me, when I was first made aware of, you know, this issue about origins and, the biblical understanding where we come from, I compromised. I didn't know I had, but someone was gracious enough to pull me to the right resources to help me see.

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Oh, wow. I have been compromising God's word. And if you compromise it here, this compromise over there, I'm undermining a multiple biblical doctrine. I didn't realize it. And so they began, help me by God's grace, to correct my thinking. Get a biblical foundation which affected some of the things I know exactly. Right. That's the same thing on this issue.

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To correct our thinking and to get along with God's Word and let the viewer understand this is not. What does Brian Osborne think? No one should care what I think. What does the Bible say? What is the biblical understanding of these issues? How do we have true reconciliation according to God's Word? How does God define us? How does God give us understanding of how we are broken and what the right answer is?

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I've said this numerous times, but it's the same. But so true. Is that biblical understanding? How do we get to that? How do I get my thinking in line with that? And then when you do that, you've got answers and you can defend your faith and you can point people to the gospel and you can be encouraged. I think many Christians are scared to death.

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Like, I don't have answers. I don't know how to think about this. I don't know what they mean by that. I don't know what I should do here. I think this book, by God's grace, is a great tool that you can have clarity of thought, get good answers, know what they teach, see why it's not biblical, and then you can engage people.

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Help your family with the right biblical understanding. I love that, and I love that you keep bringing out that. To take every thought captive. You are helping us take wrong thought captive into the obedience of Christ, bringing in the truth so that we can find the lie. Deal with the lie, but then speaking the truth in love. One of the endorsements that you have from, Doctor Purdum, there are answers in Genesis.

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She talked about how you do help us speak the truth and love on this topic, and it really is an issue between the person and God, not really the person and you. That's right. So it's it's not about your ideas like you just said. It's not about who you are and why you can speak on this. It's about what God's Word says.

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So if we are if we can remove ourselves out of that equation and see ourselves as that helper. Now, whether they accept our help or not, that's up to them. But if we are a helper to say here, here's what God says, and I want you and God to have a terrific relationship, you know, I want you to be his friend and he be your friend, and you understand what he meant for this world.

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And then if they say no and they don't want to hear it, at least you've said it. And you're responsible to God for that conversation, are you? You're exactly right. And I will tell you this, too. This takes such a weight off of off of our shoulders, if we can rightly understand this, because I think for a lot of us, we do get very tense and very nervous and understand why about engaging on these issues, because we think it's going to be combative.

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It's going to be a conflict that most of us don't like conflict. And if you like it, that could be scary too. All right. So it could be problems of both into that equation. But so we don't want conflict. And so we're scared to engage and, but like you just said, if we present it rightly, which the issue really is, it's not me versus you.

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It's it's really you versus what God says. Are you going to do that? And so that takes the the focus away from you. It puts it where it should be, which is on God. And now they must wrestle. Okay. So am I going to submit to what God says, or am I going to reject it and still hold my own thinking?

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They have to make that call like you just said, but takes it off you and then also our responsibility is to proclaim we cannot change anyone's heart. We cannot change anyone's mind. We just can't. Or only God has a power. He has told us to be obedient, to give an answer, to have a biblical worldview, to defend the faith, proclaimed the gospel, to make disciples.

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And then he, by His Spirit through his work, changes hearts and lives. And again that takes another weight off our shoulders, right? We just have to be obedient. That's it. Just about God. Here's his word. And for some that sounds overly simplistic, but that's the reality of what it is. That is a truth. And now when you apply it out, it takes diligence.

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We got to study. We got to know, we got to work. But, you can have an answer and the standard fan and like I do, what do I got to do? Which is change hearts and minds. Right. So study to show yourself approved work and justice will help you do that in the culture that we're living in so that we can be servant Christians, servant leaders, to point people back to the truth so they won't be deceived.

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Amen. So thank you so much, Brian, for taking the time to answer all of our questions for taking the time to write this book. I'm so excited for everybody to have the opportunity to read it. Just imagine the few of us that have been here today just with this new information that we have, how we can change multiple conversations for the glory of God.

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And then once people, hundreds and thousands of people read this book, just then, the way God will take those seeds and and develop real trees of righteousness. Amen. It's all God. You know, I pray that he does a mighty work that is for his glory. I do believe those who are watching this. If you read this, you will be equipped.

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You'll have answers. And again, it is gospel focused. So as I told one person during the interview, this is about loving people, honoring them, respecting them. But loving God first and foremost, proclaiming his truth and honoring people by proclaiming truth and caring about their souls. Kids, with that foundation and the answers are there. They're not hard. And at the super long, fairly concise book, a bit longer than quick answers to tough questions.

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But right. It's all of this, but still concise overall and to the point. And you can understand it. You can defend and you can proclaim the good news. Absolutely. Well, thanks again for being here. Thank you to all of our cast and crew. I don't know what to call you our friends that asked questions. We appreciate all of you being here and, we hope that you will all take the opportunity to comment.

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And, the months of Master Books Facebook group, as well as the Master Books app, those of you who are listening, you have an opportunity to win a digital copy of this book. So we'll look forward to seeing you in those places. And thanks again, Brian, for being here. Thanks for having me. See you guys. Bye. Hey, thanks for joining us today for the Master Books podcast.

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It was really fun to do this with you today. We hope that you'll take a moment and rank and review the podcast wherever you are listening or watching, so that others can find it more easily. We loved having you here, and we look forward to being with you on the next podcast comes out every other week, Mondays at 5 a.m. see you then.